tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post6974083921308882603..comments2023-11-03T06:26:00.486-07:00Comments on Ms. Kitty's Saloon and Road Show: Going in PeaceUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-26522258389677947062010-10-18T11:26:57.923-07:002010-10-18T11:26:57.923-07:00@goodwolve -- A few years ago at Ferry Beach, the ...@goodwolve -- A few years ago at Ferry Beach, the Universalist conference center in Maine, some kids told me they didn't like this song, because it felt like they were being kicked out. So they made up alternate words: "Go now eat peas, macaroni and cheese..." -- alas, I forget the rest of it.<br /><br />Anyway, because of what those kids told me, now I find I can't use this song when I'm leading worship. Too bad, because it's a good song.Dan Harperhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03250484049882575283noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-89814397175420796982010-10-17T16:51:02.924-07:002010-10-17T16:51:02.924-07:00I'm so sorry, Anon. It shouldn't have bee...I'm so sorry, Anon. It shouldn't have been done. It was not only unethical, it was technically illegal, I think.Lilylouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02328027965155428624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-51175702004867871882010-10-17T16:40:20.165-07:002010-10-17T16:40:20.165-07:00It was in all the hymnals. I discussed, politely,...It was in all the hymnals. I discussed, politely, my disappointment with the minister after the service. I'd gone to the church because my first child had just been born the previous day and I felt a need to thank God and seek God's blessing on our little family. Since I grew up UU naturally the church was where I went to do that, but when I saw that my UUism wasn't wanted I left somewhat disheartened and thereafter attended a different (non-UU) religious establishment in the same city.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-75393855185656303642010-10-17T07:47:48.041-07:002010-10-17T07:47:48.041-07:00Anon, I'll bet if the minister knew that had h...Anon, I'll bet if the minister knew that had happened in a hymnal, s/he would have taken steps to address it. I'd be interested in learning whether it was just in one (or a few) hymnals, or if it had been changed in all of them. Do you know?Lilylouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02328027965155428624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-42692484371001542312010-10-17T06:47:09.340-07:002010-10-17T06:47:09.340-07:00This was quite an interesting topic, thanks for co...This was quite an interesting topic, thanks for covering it here and in your follow-up post. It really makes one think. I recall attending a UU church in Southern California one morning, and when I opened their hymnal to sing "Go Now in Peace" I discovered they had literally crossed out God with a pen and written "spirit of love" above the line. Immediately, I understood that my liberal UU theology was unwelcome at that church, and never returned. I think if the Sleeth estate heard about that practice, they'd probably be upset.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-11375742580818504912010-10-15T19:12:49.443-07:002010-10-15T19:12:49.443-07:00Thanks, Tom, I appreciate your input. I'm goi...Thanks, Tom, I appreciate your input. I'm going to ask around and see where our official leaders got this message.Lilylouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02328027965155428624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-88237662249699211722010-10-15T18:34:43.906-07:002010-10-15T18:34:43.906-07:00Ms. Kitty,
This came up at our church about 4 yea...Ms. Kitty,<br /><br />This came up at our church about 4 years ago. I started investigating by googling "Natalie Sleeth". When I realized she died 2 years before the gray hymnal was published, I became suspicious. More googling revealed that she was an important author in the Methodist tradition. I couldn't find any evidence that she ever showed any awareness of UUs.<br /><br />I did find a lot of UU handwringing, but it was all hearsay. Nobody ever claimed, for example, to have seen a letter from her family complaining about anything.<br /><br />So, knowing how radioactive the word "God" is in UU circles, I guessed this was probably an urban legend.<br /><br />Anyway, once our RE committee realized that Sleeth had died a long time ago, they decided this wasn't a problem. (Legally, of course, we can sing anything we want in a service. We are totally exempt from copyright rules.)Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-78285730482874712332010-10-15T13:56:54.969-07:002010-10-15T13:56:54.969-07:00You raise interesting points, Tom. I'm wonder...You raise interesting points, Tom. I'm wondering what resources you used to investigate this story. I heard it from our district Program Consultant and also from our District Trustee. Can you say more about what you looked at in order to verify the story?Lilylouhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02328027965155428624noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-18231384544186919342010-10-15T13:52:59.223-07:002010-10-15T13:52:59.223-07:00The idea of "Go now in peace" is an impo...The idea of "Go now in peace" is an important one", I think. In visiting a Lutheran congregation recently, I enjoyed the fact that they used the "Peace be with you" greeting, which is shared with Jewish and Islamic and earlier Christian groups. Peace (whatever interpretation one may make of it), is wished for both children and adults, and for members of other religious movements. The song expresses the wish of peace for them whether they participate in a UU formal service or not.LinguistFriendhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02695715246663202212noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-41606845037368775062010-10-15T12:37:23.015-07:002010-10-15T12:37:23.015-07:00I investigated this story a couple of years ago an...I investigated this story a couple of years ago and could not find evidence that most of it is true.<br /><br />It appears that at the time the UUA was preparing the Gray hymnal they wrote to Ms. Sleeth's publishing house asking for permission to change the words in print. This permission was denied.<br /><br />At the time Sleeth herself was either dead or seriously ill. (She died in 1992 after a long illness.) I don't know if she was personally involved in the decision. In any case, it is perfectly normal for writers to oppose other people changing their words in published versions of their work. I know of no evidence that Sleeth ever objected to our singing whatever we want. Indeed I know of no evidence that Sleeth ever knew we existed.<br /><br />You refer to Sleeth's "family". Who is that? I believe her kids, Molly and David, are still alive, but I can't find any evidence they care about what we sing. <br /><br />In any case, why do we care about the opiniions of her descendents and not the opinions of the descendents of, say, Isaac Watts or John Calvin? What moral principle is involved here?<br /><br />My take is that this whole thing has been manufactured, probably by someone who finds the UU "God" allergy annoying. I like God too, but I don't think it is right to lie to the congregation.<br /><br />But maybe you have found something we couldn't find. How do you know the story is true?Tomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-30312228.post-34304584457771185412010-10-15T10:26:54.940-07:002010-10-15T10:26:54.940-07:00As I have said elsewhere, I hate this song... well...As I have said elsewhere, I hate this song... well hate is strong, but it just sounds so "get the hell out of here little people and their teachers who do not belong in proper worship with us the adults". It isn't personal, but it feels like such a get out of here moment. Not sure ANY song would be good for this. - Jgoodwolvehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05475291423805924571noreply@blogger.com